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Recently (not very recently but a couple of months ago) there was a change in room ownership in Hinduism chat room. A couple of old owners were removed from the list of Room owners. After a week or two of this removal happened, a new room owner was added.

There was no reason given for the removal of room owners. When I pinged the moderators for giving a reason at least about informing that there were changes in the chat room owner's list, there was no response. The message from the Feeds which make the users aware of the changes to the room was deleted immediately by a moderator (I don't know which moderator it is). So, I was clueless that I am removed as room owner. I came to know that I am no longer a room owner looking at my name. Generally, name of the room owner is in italic and normal user name looks without italic font. When I pinged moderators, there was no reply regarding this. Only thing a moderator said was about a comment on meta which he edited saying I was mocking without explaining why and how it is related to chat room moderation or without explaining why it is mocking of users. But I believe that is not related to chat room matters. I don't recall any drama or abusing happening in the chat room while I was present in the room.

If you ask why now and not immediately, I had other reasons to go inactive on meta. I didn't had time to post. Similar issue happened about the removal of a moderator without notice somewhere in the network and there is discussion going on many meta sites including Meta Stack Exchange. I was reminded of this issue.

If you ask why to post on meta when it is a chat room matter?

  • Why not? This happened on our site at some point. We can post issues if it still persists.

  • It is main chat room created by default. Since chat room is also a part of the site, I believe this discussion belongs on meta.

  • There was no proper reply from moderators regarding this issue in chat rooms.

  • Only room for moderation issues is frozen and all the moderators were not active in that chat room.

  • Even if they are active, chat is not a correct place to post discussions. Meta is the default space for discussions about site.

  • For increasing transparency in moderator's actions. If moderators are answering and being accountable for their actions, it is good for the community and more users will know. The discussion reaches wider audience.

So the questions I have in mind are these:

  • What were the reasons for the moderators to make changes in the list of room owners?

  • What wrong happened in the chat room moderation to take a sudden decision without notice?

  • Is it fair to remove a room owner without informing or a pinging the reason why the change happened? Also is it fair to delete the feeds message which says there is a change to the room?

  • Why was the message deleted?

Note: Since this issue was dealt by moderator(s), I expect only them to write an answer.

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    Maybe mods have their own story but right now this feels unfair. Even I was room owner but realized I wasn't anymore, recently. – Mr_Green Oct 18 '19 at 6:04
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    @Mr_Green If they have a back story, let them reveal it. In Meta or in chat at least. As far as I remember, nothing serious happened in the chat room while I was there. If there is something related to site activity, I think that should be treated on site too. But nothing like that happened. – Sarvabhouma Oct 18 '19 at 9:07
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    yes this is a clear mistake from mod(s)'s end. They should at least apologise / announce their mistake. – Mr_Green Oct 18 '19 at 9:10
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    @Mr_Green Mods here never apologise. And now since this is been brought to Meta, we can see many changes secretly. – Krishna Shweta Oct 18 '19 at 16:01
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    So there was no notice or intimation for removing ROs. It's already 2 days.. there no single comment from mods, as expected – Krishna Shweta Oct 18 '19 at 16:04
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    @KrishnaShweta better make meta posts about area51 proposal as it attracts more attention from mods :D – Ankit Sharma Oct 21 '19 at 10:58
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    Yes @AnkitSharma that's correct. There are many languages in which scriptures are written, let's discuss about them :D – Krishna Shweta Oct 22 '19 at 14:23
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Talking users in a friendly way is an essential thing to maintain a peaceful, healthy and enthusiastic environment and discussion in chat. It does happen sometimes that we get engage with users in series of arguments may be endless. Arguing is fine but it should be constructive conversation. Non-constructive way of endless arguments is not a good idea. Some users has been getting irritated by endless non-constructive arguments.

Another aspect is that one should be optimistic and in the favor of growth of community and problem solution rather than just criticizing negatively and showing the whole community in a bad way. Having a prejudice about moderators is also not a good thing.

Considering all these things and activity, we (moderator team) decided to change Room-Ownership. We expect that Room Owner should be optimistic and enthusiast for the community, friendly and constructive while discussion, humble, patience and considerate while talking about issues or inquiring justifications.

If we see you displaying these constructive communication styles over the next few months, we can discuss reinstating you as a Room Owner.

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    Citation needed for users getting irritated and showing pessimistic behaviour. There was something called assume good faith. Is showing dissent or arguing for a long time with moderators a factor to be removed? Why to remove the messages and not informing to me? Any thoughts on that? – Sarvabhouma Oct 23 '19 at 16:09
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    Talking users in a friendly way is an essential thing to maintain a peaceful, healthy and enthusiastic environment and discussion in chat exactly, it was there when Sarvabhouma was RO. You have alleged every single point you wrote here. Come up with the proofs and then answer. – Krishna Shweta Oct 23 '19 at 16:32
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    Lol If we see you displaying these constructive communication styles over the next few months, we can discuss reinstating you as a Room Owner check the current ROs if they are "really" keeping peace, healthy etc whatever! – Krishna Shweta Oct 23 '19 at 16:35
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    Btw, where were you when these questions were asked in the room itself. Btw, you answer is partial. There are many subquestions. Who will answer those? – Krishna Shweta Oct 23 '19 at 16:37
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    -1, for being overly generic and not expanding properly. I see Mr Green broke no rule neither Sarv. And also why RO change was kept so secret ? – Ankit Sharma Oct 23 '19 at 16:54
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    I would have been happy if this answer was explaining something and more clear. If I were a mod, I would have put a notice on it (more explanation needed & citation needed.) If your reason is arguing or showing dissent for this action, I am helpless in this. You're probably citing some year old discussion which I had with your fellow mod or you which were not too serious. In a discussion, it's natural that there are two sides of a coin. I am open to criticism and I expect other side to be the same. Perhaps it's just me. Instead of saying some users, you should've said mods. (continued) – Sarvabhouma Oct 24 '19 at 4:04
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    Unfortunately, this answer would've been better if it's true to the events as they happened. The "endless arguments" happen when 2 sides are participating. But it's been long since a mod participated in a moderation discussion in chat and that too in main room. Users have dodged some discussions saying I never stop once I start sarcastically. Many people have different type of patience levels. Some (especially on this site) are very thin skinned. If there's a benchmark, it should be according to CoC. Not according to a mod or other user. If there's mocking, why were no serious warnings given? – Sarvabhouma Oct 24 '19 at 4:08
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    I can't be optimistic about the community seeing no activity, no proper response etc., there is definitely optimism left which is why I still asked clarifications in chat, even after 2 months, I posted a meta hoping an answer. I can be optimistic but I can't be panglossian. I expect a mod to be responsive, active and listening to community along with downside. Any truly active chat user when I was an RO would know the situation how it was. I don't think patient is waiting for a month for a reply like "I don't know what are those problems" even when I pinged at least 20 times for a same issue. – Sarvabhouma Oct 24 '19 at 4:14
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    Whether I was not enthusiast about community or not, it's evident from the site activity. Friendly nor not, it will be known if chat room is visited. What surprises me is saying months and considering year old discussions where a mod disagreed to discuss further mentioning my faith and continued the discussion citing an old message from you which said I was talking like MSE chat in Hinduism chat room. I talk the same in every chat room. I'm aware it's a different here but Hinduism chat shouldn't disengage itself from SE, CoC with RO, mod's own book of rules brought into force. – Sarvabhouma Oct 24 '19 at 4:23
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    @KrishnaShweta "Btw, you answer is partial. There are many subquestions. Who will answer those?" Ummm how is this answer partial answer? Which questions of mine did this answer exactly answer? I only see last line directed towards me asking me to impress the moderators and wait for few months for a reply as usual. – Sarvabhouma Oct 24 '19 at 7:03

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